Posted: Thursday May 29th, 2014 02:19 pm |
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I have done a post on this before
PLEASE we need clarity on the following.
----- take a look at the following post http://www.comfortforums.com/forum113/3695.html"The UCM/ETH03 allows Comfigurator and other 3rd party software to work with Comfort"------------So can you tell me - the UCM/ETH03 can I use it for programming? can I use it for remote IP interfacing/control?------------
You have UCM's ( UNIVERSAL Communication Modules) that are in effect NOT UNIVERSAL..
So the set of UCM's that ONLY allow communication to the Comfort BUS i.e. Comfigurator should be named something like CMP - (Communication Module - Program) ( as a suggestion !) as they ONLY allow communication to the Cytech bus for programming.e.g. UCM/USB UCM/232 UCM/ETH ( rename CMP/USB CMP/232 CMP/ETH etc)
You ALSO have a set of UCM's that allow remote communication for interfacing purposes ONLY ( NOT programming). Again I would not use the word 'Universal' (implying that it can do everything!) so perhaps rename/call these CMI (Communication Module - Interface). so the Ethernet module that allows remote communication to a third party device would be called CMI/ETH03 !
You would not believe the confusion that your naming set up has given over the years - try talking to Laser !
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Posted: Thursday May 29th, 2014 07:17 pm |
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juwi_uk
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Surely the "Universal" in UCM refers to the common hardware module on which they are all based and nothing to do with WHAT they can do for the user. That's the bit AFTER the slash i.e. "UCM/xxxxxxxx". Why should it matter what "UCM" stands for?
Granted it would be nice if all base boards could be "re-tasked" by re-flashing; for example I want to "re-task" this UCM/Eth3 to be UCM\Universal, or I want to replace the GSM4 daughtercard with a ZWave one and "re-task" the software accordingly. Granted the base UCM's have gone through a few iterations without/with U2 socket for example but it does feel this constraint is more a marketing than technical constraint.
That said, IMHO I cant see what all the fuss is about otherwise and Cytech have been a good job giving us all of these connectivity options in the first place.
Who exactly is getting confused by this; I'm not confused (for example ), I would hope distributers wouldn't be as they've hopefully been fully trained on Cytech products in the first place and prospective end users...well shouldn't the distributers be advising them being their prospects/customers? And if all else fails Cytech have a second to none forum that is there to react quickly to customers questions and concerns!
My feedback for what it's worth!
Julian
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Posted: Thursday May 29th, 2014 07:50 pm |
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ITS CONFUSING PERIOD !
I'M CONFUSED
SPEAK TO DISTRUBUTORS THEY ARE CONFUSED
AND DONT GET CUSTOMERS INVOLVED AS THEY WILL BE CONFUSED
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Posted: Thursday May 29th, 2014 08:20 pm |
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juwi_uk
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Renaming products isn't going to help either then; it's a training issue surely?
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Posted: Saturday May 31st, 2014 07:12 am |
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slychiu
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UCM/ETH03 allows Comfigurator and other 3rd party software to work with Comfort"------------So can you tell me - the UCM/ETH03 can I use it for programming? can I use it for remote IP interfacing/control?------------
if it "allows Comfigurator to work with Comfort" then it can be used for programming right?
The term UCM refers to a class of products which can communicate with other systems using the same baseboard and plug in architecture.
UCM/ETH03, UCM/USB, UCM/232 have ethernet, USB and RS232 interfaces respectively and are used for programming by Comfigurator. They are also used for communications by the Comfort iPhone, iPad, and android apps as well as 3rd party software like ComfortClient which communicate using the Comfort Protocol.
Other UCMs communicate with 3rd party systems, which are indicated by the suffix UCM/xxx, eg - UCM/GSM for GSM interface
- UCM/CBUS for Cbus
- UCM/KNX for KNX
- UCM/Duplne for Dupline/SmartHouse
- UCM/Velbus for Velbus
- UCM/Zwave for Zwave
- UCM/Universal for most other external products not supported by a specific UCM
These external UCMs do not use the Comfort protocol, they implement the protocol of the products which is communicating with.
All UCMs are interfaces between the Comfort Bus and another system, whether it is a PC running software (Comfigurator, ComfortClient) , or another 3rd part product
These are part numbers only. You need to look into the details of part numbers to fully understand what the product does, but I believe the part numbers already give some indication of the function.
I hope this explains it so that you are no longer confused, but if I have still not done a good job of explaining it, I doubt that just renaming the part numbers will help.
Changing well known part numbers at this stage would probably cause more confusion, eg users asking why they ordered one product and received another. Manuals, labels, brochures, training all would need to be changed and a lot of explanation required on forums and queries by email.
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Posted: Saturday May 31st, 2014 12:09 pm |
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juwi_uk
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Sounds good to me.
One thing that might help is to maybe rename some of the nodes in the "UCM" section of Product Categories on the Cytech Website as maybe this is mis-leading.
For example what you've basically said above is there are two groups:
- UCM's where the Target Device(s) use the Comfort Protocol
- UCM's where the Target Device(s) use the Manufacturers own Protocol
On the website you group as:
- PC Interfaces
- External Interfaces
And for the former (PC interfaces) you mention main use as for configuration rather than for access also by other Comfort & 3rd party apps.
Then to class the GSM UCM as a "Special Purpose UCM" to me makes it sound like it is not a mainstream product.
Maybe regrouping here might help circumvent any confusion when users are browsing to buy.
Maybe something like:
- External Protocol Interfaces
- Comfort Protocol Interfaces
or
- External Hardware Access
- Application Software Access
Personally I would put the GSM UCM in the latter too as you can send messages to it via the Comfort Protocol as well! Then in each put a summary of what you said above so absolutely clear to people.
Julian
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Posted: Saturday May 31st, 2014 04:55 pm |
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Posted: Saturday May 31st, 2014 10:04 pm |
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Ingo
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Here is my quick answer to the initial question:
The UCM/Eth03 can be used with Comfigurator meaning you can program Comfort with it.
And Yes, you can send Ethernet commands to a remote IP destination.
Here is the catch (if I remember correctly), it's one-way only, outbound to a remote IP. If you want two-way communication then you need a UCM/Universal with an Ethernet Sub Module - Cytech can confirm this.
So the marketing statement is correct, it's up to the Integrator to know the product and decide which will best suit the customers needs.
Ingo
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Posted: Monday Jun 2nd, 2014 01:16 pm |
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ident
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Thanks for all comments
we shall try to produce an informative matrix
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Posted: Tuesday Jun 3rd, 2014 11:18 am |
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Posted: Wednesday Jun 4th, 2014 12:23 pm |
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Posted: Wednesday Jun 4th, 2014 04:17 pm |
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ident
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There is already a topic on Introduction to UCMs see http://www.comfortforums.com/forum4/46.html
This has been updated so it should be a good introduction to the types of UCMs and clear up any confusion about the part numbers if any
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Posted: Wednesday Jun 4th, 2014 09:23 pm |
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Ingo
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Let me take a final stab at it. For all us 'Old Folks' which have been around for a few years the following might sound familiar.
The old UCM01 was a fixed serial UCM to program Comfort with, you probably still have one lying around somewhere. It was then replaced by a newer UCM05 but essentially doing the same thing.
Now here is where some confusion might come in. When you run Comfigurator and scan the UCM's it lists them as UCM01/02/03/04/05 etc. and those names have somehow stuck in our minds.
Ok, so bearing that in mind, the bottomline is that the UCM01 and UCM05 doesn't exist anymore. Any reference to them is incorrect unless you refer to the first and fifth UCM in your system.
The UCM06 is just a Baseboard which takes lots of different sub-modules. As a supplier you would stock a few UCM06 baseboards and a couple of different sub-modules. You never know who is going to walk into the shop asking for a UCM/485. All you do is to pull out a UCM06 baseboard an a RS485 sub-module and voila, sorted. The same goes for Ethernet, RS232 and USB.
I myself also refer to a UCM05 as a UCM/232 but with time I should start using the correct product names but like I said, the UCM05 name is stuck in my mind and will always mean UCM/232 in my setup.
The rest of the UCMs are protocol specific and is very nicely explained in the link supplied by ident.
Cytech, am I right with my understanding? If so I hope it helps other people understand it better.
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Posted: Thursday Jun 5th, 2014 06:14 am |
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ident
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When you run Comfigurator and scan the UCM's it lists them as UCM01/02/03/04/05 etc. and those names have somehow stuck in our minds.
I am not sure what you mean. Are you referring to the names generated by the scanning if you start with a blank template? These are arbitrary names and not the model numbers. The UCM Type is listed after scannning, UCM/ETH, USB etc are shown as type "General"
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Posted: Thursday Jun 5th, 2014 08:29 am |
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Ingo
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Yes, that is what I mean. The names are arbitrary but it's just blind luck that it's also the same as the old UCM01 and UCM05 hence possible confusion.
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Posted: Monday Jun 9th, 2014 11:53 am |
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Bearing in mind that we see many older installations done by other people can we also have an identification chart with the matrix. i.e a pictorial representation of each different type of UCM with the part code sticker numbers.
Thanks
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