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Comfort UPNP <-> SmartThings <-> Amazon Echo
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 Posted: Monday Oct 31st, 2016 01:54 am
   
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Swiss-Toni
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Forgive my ignorance, but what interface would you use without samsung smarthings using Amazon echo directly with comfort (I am presuming it would be through Etho conncetion & the echo programed accordingly, The voice control aspect is very appealing, I do not use either echo or smarthings, But I can see this as an extension and will be come obligatory in the very near future......



 Posted: Monday Oct 31st, 2016 02:17 am
   
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lwillerton
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Hi Matt,

I was reading back through the posts and I just want to check that I understand correctly, will the interface allow me to run a scene or response setup in Comfort.

E.g If I interface with the Yamaha amp through the universal UCM and run one of the 12 Yamaha scenes to turn on amp set volume etc and also fire an IR TV on command can echo and ST the trigger this scene or response?

Was also thinking of buying the heatmiser UCM would I be able to set temperatures or turn on the hot water using dot ST and comfort?

Is there a plan to include flags as well as counters? my system auto arms unless a flag is set to stop the task. So dot command to that sets auto arm or stops auto arm.

If this is the case the operatunities are endless and limited to the individuals imagination. Once ST and dot can run comfort responses happy days very powerful combination.

This seems to be one of the most exciting additions to what is alread a great system.

Best Wishes

Lee



 Posted: Monday Oct 31st, 2016 04:28 pm
   
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mattbrain
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@Swiss-Toni

I have used SmartThings as a mediation layer between Echo and Comfort - The Echo supports SmartThings natively and therefore makes things easy. I am working on a variant of the UPNP software which exposes Comfort zones and outputs (and possibly flags) to other devices, including Echo, via WeMo emulation - as these seem like popular IOT devices with broad support and they are simple enough to be able to emulate without too much trouble. Whilst this will allow the Echo to talk directly to the Comfort, it is limited in terms of capability. I plan to emulate WeMo sockets to map to outputs and flags (simple on / off) and WeMo motion sensors to emulate zones.

@Lee

Yes, good question, I also plan to support flags (and it is likely I will finish these before counters). They will appear in SmartThings as devices with switch capabilities, similar to outputs but without flash/flashonce.

Responses will also be supported - not sure yet how to do this, I was thinking of a device per response, allowing it to be triggered like a switch.

Counters will be supported and will look like variable devices (such as dimmable bulbs), exposing the value of the counter as a 'brightness' value and allowing SmartThings to set discrete values and increment/decrement the counter as appropriate.

I'm in the middle of a critical piece of my day job at the moment, so I won't have time to do much this week, but hope to have something back to you all to try before the weekend.

Thanks,

Matt

Last edited on Monday Oct 31st, 2016 04:41 pm by mattbrain



 Posted: Monday Oct 31st, 2016 09:05 pm
   
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mattbrain
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Hi All

Having given this some more thought (and prototyped some of it) I am proposing the following.

Zones and Outputs will be implemented as they are.
Counters will be implemented like Outputs, but with configurable actions for On/Off (set to a specific value, increment / decrement and a slider to set a specific value similar to that of a dimmable bulb in SmartThings
Flags will be simple on/off switches
Responses will be a switch where the on button triggers the response

As this has the potential to create many hundreds of virtual devices in SmartThings, I am changing the alarm.config format to require the desired zones, outputs, flags, counters and responses be explicitly listed, so for example

maxzones = 16 is now deprecated and replaced with zones = 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16.

This should also increase performance on Pi and allow the user to only expose those things required. It does place an additional burden of effort on the user to list out the things required, but I think the effort / benefit trade-off is worth it.

I anticipate I will have a new release for the end of the week supporting at least Flags and Responses if not the whole lot.

Alarm state / set / unset is in the works and will follow shortly afterwards.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Matt 



 Posted: Tuesday Nov 1st, 2016 11:55 am
   
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wexfordman
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Hi Matt, really excited about this, gotta figure out now the route I need to go. I had been holding off in the echo in favour of Google's home, but this might be the trigger to go to echoe



 Posted: Tuesday Nov 1st, 2016 11:55 am
   
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wexfordman
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Hi Matt, really excited about this, gotta figure out now the route I need to go. I had been holding off in the echo in favour of Google's home, but this might be the trigger to go to echoe



 Posted: Wednesday Nov 2nd, 2016 12:12 am
   
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lwillerton
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Hi All,

Is there a problem with ST security?

Do we think cytech will make a UCM to connect to amazon echo or google home?

Cheers

Lee



 Posted: Wednesday Nov 2nd, 2016 04:13 pm
   
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mattbrain
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Thats a really good question, and i'm sure other people have different views on this, but here are mine:

The Cytech solution, when not connected to a network is quite secure. A determined bad actor could potentially guess the usercode (and therefore gain access) by taking advantage of the telephone interface or keypad (either by brute force or educated guessing)

When it is connected to a network, the Cytech serial protocol (presented over IP) is unencrypted and trivial, a bad actor could easily listen to activity to determine the usercode or use brute force to crack it. Common sense security will help prevent this by not allowing internet access to the UCM/Eth module, putting it on a seperate VLAN etc.

If integration of the Comfort system into third party devices is desirable (which it is for me), security risks can be mitigated in the following ways:
* Limit direct access to the UCM to only authorised devices
* I have done this by putting the UCM/Eth and a secondary interface on the Pi on their own subnet, with the primary interface on my Lan without any routing enabled
* Ensure that devices which expose Comfort functions are locked down
* I have configured the Pi to only exposes Linux services necessary for Comfort
* The configuration file for the UPNP interface limits the features exposed to those which I think are necessary for the integrations I want to do

This means that only the Pi can talk to Comfort, and only things within my home network can talk to the Pi.

If the question is, is ST as a platform secure, the answer has to be 'only as secure as any other cloud based service'. Amazon Echo and Google Home are also cloud based services and have the same inherent weaknesses. Obviously by combining Echo and ST, the security risk is increased, but if there is no vector to do mischief on Comfort as you have only exposed the functions necessary on the Pi - the risk is minimal.

It has been mentioned before (by David I think) but in my opinion, leave Comfort in charge of critical stuff (security and safety) and then use ST / Echo / Google / Vera to perform all the fancy home automation stuff which are enhanced by third party services or integrations.





 Posted: Wednesday Nov 2nd, 2016 07:57 pm
   
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DavidJ
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I would have thought there are easier ways, if a thief was that determined, to break into a property than trying to hack into the alarm remotely. If they are that techy it would be easier and certainly achieve a better return by hacking into your bank account.



 Posted: Wednesday Nov 2nd, 2016 09:41 pm
   
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mattbrain
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Hi All

I have now added Counter and Flag support as well as made other changes to the configuration.

Please see the updates posted at https://github.com/mattbrain/Cytech-Comfort

If you are updating an existing configuration, please take note of the updates section at the bottom of the installation notes, you will need to download and modify the alarm.config as significant changes have been introduced which will not function if this file is not updated appropriately.

I am planning another release (likely early next week) which will allow responses to be triggered and the alarm set / unset to be controlled by SmartThings.

Thanks,

Matt



 Posted: Wednesday Nov 2nd, 2016 09:56 pm
   
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Swiss-Toni
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Last edited on Wednesday Nov 2nd, 2016 10:45 pm by Swiss-Toni



 Posted: Thursday Nov 3rd, 2016 03:04 am
   
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lwillerton
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Hi All

Sorry another question.

Vera worked with z-wave UCM. If I move everything over to ST will that include the z-wave UCM in to the ST z-wave network? Also will ST be able to do an association from a door sensor or z-wave PIR to a comfort virtual node?

Currently I have a light sensor connected to comfort which turns on lights when it goes dark (planning on installing electric blinds to shut as well), this is better than setting a set time. My lights also trigger by PIR's differently depending on security mode. I am just trying to work out if I need comfort to send commands to ST or ST to send commands to comfort or (think preferred option) a bi directional operation, this would mean if ST fails comfort would still ensure lights, blinds etc work.

@DavidJ good point about security. Think I will take a look at some of Matt's ideas though.

Best Wishes

Lee



 Posted: Friday Nov 4th, 2016 02:59 pm
   
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mattbrain
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@Lee
It looks like this could be resolved in several ways.

Given that the most robust solution is one which doesn't involve ST or Vera, can you pair the devices directly with Comfort via the UCM. You can then add basic automation using Comfort which will survive power and broadband outage events.

More complex automations, such as those which require input / outputs / control from ST or attached third party interfaces can then be performed if you expose the Z-Wave devices as virtual outputs / flags / counters / responses mapped to ST devices.

Thanks,

Matt



 Posted: Wednesday Nov 9th, 2016 01:18 am
   
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lwillerton
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Hi

I have gone ahead and purchased ST hub, Harmony Hub, amazon dot and for now things are working such as turning tv on setting a station, but becomes very expensive to buy all this kit for each room. Plus this setup will work well in the kitchen as you are often cooking and don't want to touch remotes. I have not purchased the raspberry pi yet, I have never set one of these up so will need some help using this to interface between Echo and comfort / comfort and ST so I hope you are all going to be to help.

I am also going to purchase the cytech kit. I am thinking the universal ucm will help access 8 scene settings on the amp which are not accessible by IR, plus the IR output from comfort will cover some of the automation in other rooms.

Just thinking out loud but if I setup the Harmony hub to do a set of IR tasks, turn on tv, select hdmi output, turn on amp etc and then fire that at comfort it could be an easy way to automate IR controlled kit using comfort.

Anyway I will be back in touch once I have installed the additional cytech kit and got the Pie working.

Best Wishes

Lee



 Posted: Wednesday Nov 9th, 2016 01:18 am
   
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lwillerton
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Hi

I have gone ahead and purchased ST hub, Harmony Hub, amazon dot and for now things are working such as turning tv on setting a station, but becomes very expensive to buy all this kit for each room. Plus this setup will work well in the kitchen as you are often cooking and don't want to touch remotes. I have not purchased the raspberry pi yet, I have never set one of these up so will need some help using this to interface between Echo and comfort / comfort and ST so I hope you are all going to be to help.

I am also going to purchase the cytech kit. I am thinking the universal ucm will help access 8 scene settings on the amp which are not accessible by IR, plus the IR output from comfort will cover some of the automation in other rooms.

Just thinking out loud but if I setup the Harmony hub to do a set of IR tasks, turn on tv, select hdmi output, turn on amp etc and then fire that at comfort it could be an easy way to automate IR controlled kit using comfort.

Anyway I will be back in touch once I have installed the additional cytech kit and got the Pie working.

Best Wishes

Lee



 Posted: Wednesday Nov 9th, 2016 01:18 am
   
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lwillerton
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Hi

I have gone ahead and purchased ST hub, Harmony Hub, amazon dot and for now things are working such as turning tv on setting a station, but becomes very expensive to buy all this kit for each room. Plus this setup will work well in the kitchen as you are often cooking and don't want to touch remotes. I have not purchased the raspberry pi yet, I have never set one of these up so will need some help using this to interface between Echo and comfort / comfort and ST so I hope you are all going to be to help.

I am also going to purchase the cytech kit. I am thinking the universal ucm will help access 8 scene settings on the amp which are not accessible by IR, plus the IR output from comfort will cover some of the automation in other rooms.

Just thinking out loud but if I setup the Harmony hub to do a set of IR tasks, turn on tv, select hdmi output, turn on amp etc and then fire that at comfort it could be an easy way to automate IR controlled kit using comfort.

Anyway I will be back in touch once I have installed the additional cytech kit and got the Pie working.

Best Wishes

Lee



 Posted: Thursday Nov 10th, 2016 07:56 pm
   
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mattbrain
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@Lee

Happy to help when you have the kit - it's probably worth spending a little time at raspberrypi.org to get to grips with how it works. You will need to be able to connect to the Pi remotely (so that you can put it somewhere sensible) using SSH (PuTTY on Windows).

I'm elbows deep in DIY at the moment, I'm hoping to do some work on responses and alarm status tomorrow evening (it's the wife's turn to go out)...

Thanks,

Matt



 Posted: Tuesday Nov 15th, 2016 03:33 am
   
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mattbrain
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Hi All
Just a quick update, not forgotten I have promised a responses update - there is one coming, I have just been dragged into more decorating by the wife. I will get something out soon, please watch this space.

Thanks,

Matt



 Posted: Tuesday Nov 15th, 2016 07:42 pm
   
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lwillerton
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Sorry All another large post, but I have been experimenting.
I now have a combination of SmartThing, Yomomi, Harmony allows the control of TV's and AV kit. Still waiting for confirmation on my Cytech additions so can't comment on them yet.  I am finding ST has very limited capabilities with z-wave, there is a big community support group, but by no way does it seem as simple as Vera copying the z-wave network to Comfort. Two fundamental show stoppers for me are:
 1, I have included 2 x 1.5kw fibaro relays and only one switch is detected so I can't control both devices within ST's
 2, When including the comfort UCM-Z-Wave it only detects a PC controller, ST doesnt seem to download the z-wave network to Comfort, massive problem and I will be migrating back to Vera over the weekend.
My conclusion is ST will not deliver the level of functionality I require for my z-wave network. For example if the internet is down and I am on holiday I still want to the alarm system to create the effect of me being at home, which comfort does very well using the UCM-Zwave bridge, but if ST doesn't pass on the Z-Wave network game over.
To be honest I want the alarm and its functions to be rock solid so that’s why I think the Z-Wave UCM is critical in my installation and on the whole comfort has achieve this in bucket loads at my house for a number of years.
I can cope with a system failure of the AV kit so if I can’t turn the TV on using the echo (this does work well using the new technologies) then no big deal. If I can’t set a scene using ST again no big deal these are nice to have items no essentials.
Possible solution moving forward:
Leave Vera as the main Z-wave network controller and do not use ST in the z-wave network, especially as the main controller.
Use the Raspberry Pi developed by Matt as an interface between, ST and Comfort. I uses counters and flags to control z-wave devices so by rights ST should be able to change the status of these via the Raspberry Pi interface very easily, not sure what this looks like on the ST App. 
Other considerations:
How would ST trigger a Comfort scene? I could install a Harmony hub in each room (very expensive) and it only controls 8 devices which includes the TV you are controlling, plus the amp i own is broken down in to 3 devices if you want to control all 3 zones. Whereas Comfort can easily learn the on / off commands for IR to control the TV and setup the rest of my AV kit using the Universal UCM. 
Would it be possible to setup ST as a secondary z-wave hub to learn the z-wave network? 
I have not managed to get Comfort to control all the combinations of a fibaro RGBW module which sits behind my TV so can only turn one colour on / off, would it be possible for ST to interface with Vera to achieve this? 
I would like to trigger a scene that puts my TV on, selects the DVD, sets the volume and sound program, sets the LED RGBW stripe behind the TV to say Red, and dims the rest of the lights. All of which is very achievable with a little bit of Comfort, Vera and Smartthings. The key is what triggers what.
Hope this all makes sense


Attachment: Update Control Plan.png (Downloaded 141 times)



 Posted: Tuesday Nov 15th, 2016 07:42 pm
   
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lwillerton
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Sorry All another large post, but I have been experimenting.
I now have a combination of SmartThing, Yomomi, Harmony allows the control of TV's and AV kit. Still waiting for confirmation on my Cytech additions so can't comment on them yet.  I am finding ST has very limited capabilities with z-wave, there is a big community support group, but by no way does it seem as simple as Vera copying the z-wave network to Comfort. Two fundamental show stoppers for me are:
 1, I have included 2 x 1.5kw fibaro relays and only one switch is detected so I can't control both devices within ST's
 2, When including the comfort UCM-Z-Wave it only detects a PC controller, ST doesnt seem to download the z-wave network to Comfort, massive problem and I will be migrating back to Vera over the weekend.
My conclusion is ST will not deliver the level of functionality I require for my z-wave network. For example if the internet is down and I am on holiday I still want to the alarm system to create the effect of me being at home, which comfort does very well using the UCM-Zwave bridge, but if ST doesn't pass on the Z-Wave network game over.
To be honest I want the alarm and its functions to be rock solid so that’s why I think the Z-Wave UCM is critical in my installation and on the whole comfort has achieve this in bucket loads at my house for a number of years.
I can cope with a system failure of the AV kit so if I can’t turn the TV on using the echo (this does work well using the new technologies) then no big deal. If I can’t set a scene using ST again no big deal these are nice to have items no essentials.
Possible solution moving forward:
Leave Vera as the main Z-wave network controller and do not use ST in the z-wave network, especially as the main controller.
Use the Raspberry Pi developed by Matt as an interface between, ST and Comfort. I uses counters and flags to control z-wave devices so by rights ST should be able to change the status of these via the Raspberry Pi interface very easily, not sure what this looks like on the ST App. 
Other considerations:
How would ST trigger a Comfort scene? I could install a Harmony hub in each room (very expensive) and it only controls 8 devices which includes the TV you are controlling, plus the amp i own is broken down in to 3 devices if you want to control all 3 zones. Whereas Comfort can easily learn the on / off commands for IR to control the TV and setup the rest of my AV kit using the Universal UCM. 
Would it be possible to setup ST as a secondary z-wave hub to learn the z-wave network? 
I have not managed to get Comfort to control all the combinations of a fibaro RGBW module which sits behind my TV so can only turn one colour on / off, would it be possible for ST to interface with Vera to achieve this? 
I would like to trigger a scene that puts my TV on, selects the DVD, sets the volume and sound program, sets the LED RGBW stripe behind the TV to say Red, and dims the rest of the lights. All of which is very achievable with a little bit of Comfort, Vera and Smartthings. The key is what triggers what.
Hope this all makes sense


Attachment: Update Control Plan.png (Downloaded 140 times)



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